My wife intelligently suggests a 3 pronged approach:
1) Knowledge; explain the situation
2) Awareness; make the guests physically aware that there are consequences. For example with tokens that each give water (perhaps 30 or 45 seconds) each. There could be a large supply and they could be included in the price of the room but the action of having to put a token in for each portion of liquid should instill a mindset of frugality.
3) Technical solutions: Timed (token dependent) activation, mist instead of waterfall, etc.
I think knowledge...almost education...is at the key of what we're doing. We hope to pass on some of the things we've learned from living in this way: the amount of single use plastic that can be wasted, how to conserve water and generate drinking water from other places, and what uses more power than anything else. We have been wondering whether guests will appreciate being forced to do things...such as take a shorter shower...is something in fitting with the luxury we're trying to provide? Perhaps tokens may be a step too far? Ana suggests an egg-timer...not that then shuts off the water, but which shows how long an "average shower" can be. But we're still pondering and wondering what's best. Thanks for your thoughts!
Most definitely the information and edification aspects very important but do not underestimate the power and value of the effects of physical activity in the learning process. Just the action of putting a token in a slot would reinforce any intellectual aspect of the learning process. (My wife is a nurse with (among others) child psychology speciality). It blew my mind when I learned about the connection between manual dexterity and learning which has been proven and is a cornerstone of Piaget's cognitive development theory.
Your ‘brochure’ should make clear what guests must expect. You only want people to come who respect nature. A visit to friends in Kenya taught me so much about the continual difficulty in finding enough water and the need to preserve it. We showered with a bucket under us to reuse in the garden. I happily adapted to the trickle of water available and felt very privileged to return to the uk to water flowing from the taps.
I imagine you've already thought a lot about the kind of people you want to attract. The adventure of being in an off-grid place should be a draw for people. So maybe it's just about the way you pitch it, so the sustainable nature of the place makes it a positive?
I think you're right Catherine - I think adventurous folk who like something a bit away from the norm might be our target audience, but I think a lot of people will enjoy the serenity, the views (and the sunshine) from our hilltop. I think the sustainability element could be a big draw.
We're at the start of the process of moving to Portugal from Brexitland and are planning to have some guest accommodation (not as ambitious as yours!) so we've been thinking about creating something that we would want to stay in ourselves. I don't know if it works as a business model but it seems to make sense that if it would work for us it would work for other people like us. And I'd be delighted to stay somewhere sustainable where we're asked to be careful about not wasting water.
The water situation is most problematic, we're in the Oeste region and can see how water, or lack thereof, is going to be a problem. Our ground is already bone hard, not normal for this time. I have maxed out my brush cutting ability with my new Stihl at two hours today to beat the deadline. Had to be waved in!. Must remember I'm 69 not 39... dehydration weight loss benefit soon negated by imbibing Pingo Doce excellent Alvorinha Reserva... we're only human. Regarding water conservation would a timer type percussion tap as fitted on sinks work? Inconvenient maybe yes but stresses the importance of saving water...boa sorte
It's tough work that strimming eh? Especially on hills! I've been doing stretching exercises before and after to try and keep the pace up...I can't do more than four hours in a day with all this heat (as I'm waking up early to write rather than to cut!). It's not far from being finished, but yesterday the plastic wire box flew off the bottom of the Stihl and I didn't notice...now I'm down a metal clip with another day to wait before the shops open...so I had to go the metal mulching blade route, which is great for tough things, but a bit overkill and slower on grass as I navigate rocks and stones! Almost there!
Must admit to be being very wary re strimming/brush cutting on slopes. Does one stand above or below the cut....? Always concerned about slipping while above the cut, my boots are steel capped with deep treads. Working laterally is the worst of both. I've heard of requests for yesterday's deadline to be extended by a fortnight. ...? One's cynicism has to be reined in when next door neighbours make no effort and no sanction is applied. Once lost the spring from my strimmer head, fortunately Teddy our dog found it!
Speaking of which...I really must head out and hit the hillsides for my evening ritual. There's usually been plenty of leeway...especially if I've made an effort to get things at least started. With the lack of rain they may limit blades and chainsaws even earlier this year. Hopefully we've done enough to keep the police happy and the rest will be belt and braces.
Do you have a house battery, e.g. a Tesla Powerwall? (Oops, El*n M*sk). We have a 17kWh battery which is fed by our little solar array and force-charged overnight a very low tariff to take it to 100% (not an option for you, but you have more solar than me, and more sun). It saves us an absolute fortune.
Hi David - we have invested in batteries to ensure we can use a lot of power over days of poor weather, so we have around 80kWh of storage in Portuguese-made batteries (MeterBoost). At the moment they're 100% before 10am, but that'll change as demand increases and we have to organise what to run, when.
Hi Alastair! Loved reading this. We were also pondering starlink but went a different route that actual proved more effective and a lot cheaper. We created a guide for those in our community which you can find here - https://usercontent.flodesk.com/
I’ve stayed in many campsites with timed showers of 3-5 minutes. I find three a bit short for a hairwash too.
In the Alentejo it is forecast to get even hotter and drier with climate change. I wonder if water there should be prioritised for local people and agriculture rather than tourists who may squander this precious resource without thinking. I guess decisions will be made by the government…hopefully not too late
We have a good capacity for storing more water in our lake, but that of course is open to evaporation (and dependent on winter rains). In terms of desalination...that's a big and expensive world that brings waste and needs a lot of power. Reverse osmosis was the first plan, but it's also too wasteful. We will keep an open mind though to see what will work the best as we move towards needing our 4000l/day from this time next year (all being well)!
Now that is the way forward!...but sadly we already have our panels in place. There's a Portuguese team doing a load of work on this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8AkaZ3PSMk
It's not - just collected rainwater. The borehole water isn't brackish...it's just slightly heavy on conductivity courtesy of mineral salts...so no seawater incursion at least!
You sound like the perfect guests..! If only everyone was so careful (I'm not sure even we are that careful, but I am in the habit of turning the tap on and off when doing my teeth!)
My wife intelligently suggests a 3 pronged approach:
1) Knowledge; explain the situation
2) Awareness; make the guests physically aware that there are consequences. For example with tokens that each give water (perhaps 30 or 45 seconds) each. There could be a large supply and they could be included in the price of the room but the action of having to put a token in for each portion of liquid should instill a mindset of frugality.
3) Technical solutions: Timed (token dependent) activation, mist instead of waterfall, etc.
I think knowledge...almost education...is at the key of what we're doing. We hope to pass on some of the things we've learned from living in this way: the amount of single use plastic that can be wasted, how to conserve water and generate drinking water from other places, and what uses more power than anything else. We have been wondering whether guests will appreciate being forced to do things...such as take a shorter shower...is something in fitting with the luxury we're trying to provide? Perhaps tokens may be a step too far? Ana suggests an egg-timer...not that then shuts off the water, but which shows how long an "average shower" can be. But we're still pondering and wondering what's best. Thanks for your thoughts!
Most definitely the information and edification aspects very important but do not underestimate the power and value of the effects of physical activity in the learning process. Just the action of putting a token in a slot would reinforce any intellectual aspect of the learning process. (My wife is a nurse with (among others) child psychology speciality). It blew my mind when I learned about the connection between manual dexterity and learning which has been proven and is a cornerstone of Piaget's cognitive development theory.
Elon Muck more like. Horrible man ☹️
I agree with the wife of Gregor
Hi there - I don’t, but I follow his updates...and see that you visited recently!
Your ‘brochure’ should make clear what guests must expect. You only want people to come who respect nature. A visit to friends in Kenya taught me so much about the continual difficulty in finding enough water and the need to preserve it. We showered with a bucket under us to reuse in the garden. I happily adapted to the trickle of water available and felt very privileged to return to the uk to water flowing from the taps.
Good thought...I think when people understand the limitations they might do what they can to help conserve.
I imagine you've already thought a lot about the kind of people you want to attract. The adventure of being in an off-grid place should be a draw for people. So maybe it's just about the way you pitch it, so the sustainable nature of the place makes it a positive?
I think you're right Catherine - I think adventurous folk who like something a bit away from the norm might be our target audience, but I think a lot of people will enjoy the serenity, the views (and the sunshine) from our hilltop. I think the sustainability element could be a big draw.
We're at the start of the process of moving to Portugal from Brexitland and are planning to have some guest accommodation (not as ambitious as yours!) so we've been thinking about creating something that we would want to stay in ourselves. I don't know if it works as a business model but it seems to make sense that if it would work for us it would work for other people like us. And I'd be delighted to stay somewhere sustainable where we're asked to be careful about not wasting water.
The water situation is most problematic, we're in the Oeste region and can see how water, or lack thereof, is going to be a problem. Our ground is already bone hard, not normal for this time. I have maxed out my brush cutting ability with my new Stihl at two hours today to beat the deadline. Had to be waved in!. Must remember I'm 69 not 39... dehydration weight loss benefit soon negated by imbibing Pingo Doce excellent Alvorinha Reserva... we're only human. Regarding water conservation would a timer type percussion tap as fitted on sinks work? Inconvenient maybe yes but stresses the importance of saving water...boa sorte
It's tough work that strimming eh? Especially on hills! I've been doing stretching exercises before and after to try and keep the pace up...I can't do more than four hours in a day with all this heat (as I'm waking up early to write rather than to cut!). It's not far from being finished, but yesterday the plastic wire box flew off the bottom of the Stihl and I didn't notice...now I'm down a metal clip with another day to wait before the shops open...so I had to go the metal mulching blade route, which is great for tough things, but a bit overkill and slower on grass as I navigate rocks and stones! Almost there!
And your rehydration technique is inspired!
Must admit to be being very wary re strimming/brush cutting on slopes. Does one stand above or below the cut....? Always concerned about slipping while above the cut, my boots are steel capped with deep treads. Working laterally is the worst of both. I've heard of requests for yesterday's deadline to be extended by a fortnight. ...? One's cynicism has to be reined in when next door neighbours make no effort and no sanction is applied. Once lost the spring from my strimmer head, fortunately Teddy our dog found it!
Speaking of which...I really must head out and hit the hillsides for my evening ritual. There's usually been plenty of leeway...especially if I've made an effort to get things at least started. With the lack of rain they may limit blades and chainsaws even earlier this year. Hopefully we've done enough to keep the police happy and the rest will be belt and braces.
Do you have a house battery, e.g. a Tesla Powerwall? (Oops, El*n M*sk). We have a 17kWh battery which is fed by our little solar array and force-charged overnight a very low tariff to take it to 100% (not an option for you, but you have more solar than me, and more sun). It saves us an absolute fortune.
Hi David - we have invested in batteries to ensure we can use a lot of power over days of poor weather, so we have around 80kWh of storage in Portuguese-made batteries (MeterBoost). At the moment they're 100% before 10am, but that'll change as demand increases and we have to organise what to run, when.
Hi Alastair! Loved reading this. We were also pondering starlink but went a different route that actual proved more effective and a lot cheaper. We created a guide for those in our community which you can find here - https://usercontent.flodesk.com/
I’ve stayed in many campsites with timed showers of 3-5 minutes. I find three a bit short for a hairwash too.
In the Alentejo it is forecast to get even hotter and drier with climate change. I wonder if water there should be prioritised for local people and agriculture rather than tourists who may squander this precious resource without thinking. I guess decisions will be made by the government…hopefully not too late
Bores create a different problem they
remove ground water.
My comment. Increase your storage capacity and/or look at your personal desal plant
We have a good capacity for storing more water in our lake, but that of course is open to evaporation (and dependent on winter rains). In terms of desalination...that's a big and expensive world that brings waste and needs a lot of power. Reverse osmosis was the first plan, but it's also too wasteful. We will keep an open mind though to see what will work the best as we move towards needing our 4000l/day from this time next year (all being well)!
Floating solar panels…reduce evaporation while creating electricity. Think of all the reservoirs in Portugal…
Now that is the way forward!...but sadly we already have our panels in place. There's a Portuguese team doing a load of work on this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8AkaZ3PSMk
It's not - just collected rainwater. The borehole water isn't brackish...it's just slightly heavy on conductivity courtesy of mineral salts...so no seawater incursion at least!
You sound like the perfect guests..! If only everyone was so careful (I'm not sure even we are that careful, but I am in the habit of turning the tap on and off when doing my teeth!)